gay marriage in CA

[Gaelin]

So... As everybody knows, it was decided earlier this year in CA that gay and lesbian couples would have the right to marry as denying them the right would be desciminatory. Awesome, I'm all for this and have been fighting for it for the past few years.

Now there is a proposition on the ballot to re-ban it. This proposition was put on the ballot through the combined efforts of religious groups all accross california and continues to be funded by many of these groups who have bought up a lot of tv time and are making free signage available to supporters. I don't have a problem with this as it is everyone's legal right to have an oppinion and peacefully protest. I do get mad as hell when I see the signs and bumper stickers and it makes me really question my neighbors. There's a sign in my neighborhood that really bugs me. I have joked with my friend (who has 3 or 4 signs in her neighborhood too) that we should go out and kick them over or turn them around to face the wrong way and we had a good laugh about it. Then she said something really profound, which was, "we might talk about doing that, but never would; but I bet that if we put up 'no on8' signs, we'd get our cars keyed and our windows broken." And I think she's right.

Still... I want to do something, so I was thinking of painting my huge living room window tomorrow with a "no on 8" message. Am i just wasting my breath and my windows? What's your opinion on it and what would you do?

[indigo0086]

At least it makes sense, a ballot to undo a previous law.  Here gay marriage is already illegal, and there's an amendment proposal stating that gay marriage be illegal.

[Gaelin]

I heard that the FL ballot measure damages or threatens domestic partnerships. Is there any truth to the rumor?

[indigo0086]

Well I am an absentee voter so I already read over it.  From what I could understand it doesn't seek to nullify other "legal unions" but not put them in similar standing with marriage.  What doesn't make sense is this sentence, "...that no other legal union that is treated as marriage or the substantial equivalent thereof shall be valid or recognized".  

Basically these kinds of things pretty much, really, violate church and state.  They want marriage to be only man and woman (I'm sure we can figure out where that rule came from).  And then if there is a legal union that while is not called marriage, is pretty much the same thing without many of the benefits a "normal" marriage would benefit from, because it's not marriage, because it's not a man and a woman.  Asking any other person - who is not an evangelical zealot - why a marriage should be man and woman you'd be hard pressed to find a good reason why it should be the case other than that it was established in religious texts and rituals in a place where there was probably old gay dude who lived in a shack and no one liked and his name was probably Lucifer and that's how we have the devil, amirite?

[Surprize152]

Yeah, I'm in Cali and I see those Yes on 8 bumper stickers on a few cars around me and it doesn't tear me up inside but make me feel sorry for the narrow mindedness that it takes to have such a freakin problem with gay people.

What seriously pisses me off is the commercial that these people made to scare tactic people into voting for them. Literally, this is how the commercial goes:

Little girl: "Mommy, mommy! I learned in class today that a princess can marry a princess."

(Parents looking concerned}

Old Out of touch with reality White Dude: "That's right. Laws are now making it legal for gay marriage and that means that schools will soon be teaching your children that a boy can marry a boy and a girl can marry a girl. Do you really want that to happen to your children."

Seriously, what the fuck does that even matter? You can't turn your kid fucking gay you stupid asses! No matter how much teaching your kid that straight is right, won't make them not gay if they are gay! I didn't learn to like women, I just do. It wasn't something that they taught me in school! Get your heads out of your asses and fucking stop being so indescribably idiotic.

(end rant)

[Lady Macbeth]

Are you serious? That pisses me off! Do it! If something happens hopefully the police will catch the perpatrators, but there's no use worrying about what might happen. I say go for it, and if you do, take a picture and post it!

[marka]

Do you really think your pro Prop 8 neighbors would get nasty and harm your property? If so, I wouldn't stick my ass into the wind alone. Do you know of any close neighbors who oppose Prop 8? If so, perhaps you could speak with them and put in a concerted effort to show your opposition. As in, united you stand safer. (If some asshole goes around vandalizing just you, it's a case number no one else hears about; if he goes around vandalizing you and three or four neighbors, it's a news story that reflects ill on the pro campaign.)

If you don't know of anyone to gang up with, then I would probably take a different approach and do something like volunteer for an evening or two to man a phone and call voters, trying to get their vote against Proposition 8. (The kernel of the matter is, it's the vote that counts.) See http://www.noonprop8.com/action

If that's not tenable, I'd at least get a formal campaign sign for your lawn rather than paint your front window, as the window-painting is more personal and almost suggests a retaliatory move (i.e., smashing the window). A formal sign seems less suggestive in that way.

I don't mean to sound like a wimp, just that I care about you and wouldn't want to see some idiots cause you trouble.

Of course, you could always go ninja and, on the sly, try to stick a pride rainbow sticker on their car bumpers. Or better yet, some rainbow-colored nutz. :p

[indigo0086]

*adds "Stick ass in wind* on to-do list*

[marka]

:lol

Always happy to provide ideas for cheap thrills ... :p

[snarg2001]

Gaelin, if your neighborhood tends to smash things I would post a cheap sign in my yard, one that isn't a big deal if it gets trashed. Better yet, several!

   Then report suspicious people lurking, just to get the police cruising your neighborhood more frequently.

[Gaelin]

k, another awful yes on 8 sign just popped up right accross the street from me. :sweatdrop I looked up signs on line and all I could find was a cafepress store selling yard signs for $15 a piece. I hear they are getting stolen all over the state (both sides), so I'm not in a big hurry to spend a bunch of money. I'm considering making my own kinkos flyers and posting them up instead. I think Saturday I'll work on the window, or maybe a banner for the porch railing.

Marka, I'm on my own here. The house to my right has been empty for years. The house on my left is occupied occasionally, but we don't really speak often. All of my lesbian neighbors moved away.

[indigo0086]

Florida voted yes on #2.  Shit happens.

[Gaelin]

I'm sorry. I'm still waiting to hear. I've had Jury Duty all week, and have been attempting to work in the evenings. :sleep

[indigo0086]

Now that I think about it, marriage needs no redefinition.  It's tied heavily to religious practices and has a pretty structured history.  What really needs to happen is for other civil unions to be legally binding.  They need to re-definie what should be taken seriously as a partnership and which of those are eligible for the benefits that apply only now to partnerships.  I find it funny, because the company I internship recognizes those things more than the government.  Things like same sex health and life insurance that binds legally to your partner, even though it doesn't involve marriage.

That at least leaves room for all those who vote no to introduce another amendment.  I mean if it's only about money, we'll see "yesOnNo2"'s real intentions when it's said they can keep marriage the same in the dictionary, but two guys or girls now get the same government benefits as a married couple

[Gaelin]

In CA, domestic partnerships are recognized and granted the same rights as hetero marriages; but there are still some huge differences. The processes are different. The recognition is different, and the timing is all out of whack. If a domestic partnership guarantees the same rights and responsibilities as marriage, why can't it just be marriage? Since "marriage" in the eyes of the state has absolutely nothing to do with religion or tradition, there is no reason to segregate gay marriages from straight marriages. They are equal and valuable.